Metal Drummers vs. Jazz Drummers

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What style of music do you think is harder to play?

Jazz
77
74%
Metal
27
26%
 
Total votes: 104
I love Cheese and drums
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Post Mon Jun 30, 2008 10:22 am

Metropolis1021 wrote:i agree that jazz is hard but it really depends on what you do with it and how far you take it musically as a drummer. and what about the progressive branch of metal. there is no end to where you can take it.


That made no sense what so ever. I could apply that same reasoning to any genre. I'm talking about taking music as far as it can go musiclly as a drummer. You wanna add something interesting to Jazz drums throw some double bass in but it has to fit the context of the tune. there are jazz drummers that could bash harder than any other metal drummer I've heard. (tony williams for one)(Charlie Adams is another) I mean I've never heard a metal band try and put a Latin feel into one of their songs I dont know maybe theres a band out there that has tried that. But Music as a whole is only limited by your creativity.
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Post Mon Jun 30, 2008 10:27 am

I love Cheese and drums wrote:
Metropolis1021 wrote:i agree that jazz is hard but it really depends on what you do with it and how far you take it musically as a drummer. and what about the progressive branch of metal. there is no end to where you can take it.


That made no sense what so ever. I could apply that same reasoning to any genre. I'm talking about taking music as far as it can go musiclly as a drummer. You wanna add something interesting to Jazz drums throw some double bass in but it has to fit the context of the tune. there are jazz drummers that could bash harder than any other metal drummer I've heard. (tony williams for one)(Charlie Adams is another) I mean I've never heard a metal band try and put a Latin feel into one of their songs I dont know maybe theres a band out there that has tried that. But Music as a whole is only limited by your creativity.

candiria has put latin and jazz into there sound. lots of people classify them as hardcore, but they have a definite metal distinction, and a sick drummer as well
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Post Mon Jun 30, 2008 10:29 am

vincemie wrote:
I love Cheese and drums wrote:
Metropolis1021 wrote:i agree that jazz is hard but it really depends on what you do with it and how far you take it musically as a drummer. and what about the progressive branch of metal. there is no end to where you can take it.


That made no sense what so ever. I could apply that same reasoning to any genre. I'm talking about taking music as far as it can go musiclly as a drummer. You wanna add something interesting to Jazz drums throw some double bass in but it has to fit the context of the tune. there are jazz drummers that could bash harder than any other metal drummer I've heard. (tony williams for one)(Charlie Adams is another) I mean I've never heard a metal band try and put a Latin feel into one of their songs I dont know maybe theres a band out there that has tried that. But Music as a whole is only limited by your creativity.

candiria has put latin and jazz into there sound. lots of people classify them as hardcore, but they have a definite metal distinction, and a sick drummer as well

Thats great! I love when bands experiment like that I'll have too check them out! :D
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vincemie
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Post Mon Jun 30, 2008 10:47 am

here you go cheese this is there myspace

http://www.myspace.com/candiria
thet have been around for a while i remember seeing them live all the way back to 1997 listen to the songs all the way through cause they mix stuff in in weird spots.
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Post Mon Jun 30, 2008 1:12 pm

I don't believe it's such a clear cut question.
If you are naturally gifted either way you of course going to find the other difficult.
Both genres have tight phrasing, both deal with tempo and Time signature changes, and both require dexterity and control over the kit. But I believe any World class Jazz player who got a call from say............ NIN would have his work cut out for him to get that angular feel just right, the same as Danny Carey would have to do serious homework getting the call from Mccoy Tyner(if he's still alive). All you guy's who ask these comparison questions forget it's a question of feel, If you don't have it you won't get the gig.
p.s I heard this once a long time ago, but apparently Sepultura's Drummer is a total monster Latin player.
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Post Mon Jun 30, 2008 1:20 pm

one of the awesome things about seeing sepultura live was when the entire band would morph into a brazilian percussion section.
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Post Mon Jun 30, 2008 1:27 pm

I love Cheese and drums wrote:
Metropolis1021 wrote:i agree that jazz is hard but it really depends on what you do with it and how far you take it musically as a drummer. and what about the progressive branch of metal. there is no end to where you can take it.


That made no sense what so ever. I could apply that same reasoning to any genre. I'm talking about taking music as far as it can go musiclly as a drummer. You wanna add something interesting to Jazz drums throw some double bass in but it has to fit the context of the tune. there are jazz drummers that could bash harder than any other metal drummer I've heard. (tony williams for one)(Charlie Adams is another) I mean I've never heard a metal band try and put a Latin feel into one of their songs I dont know maybe theres a band out there that has tried that. But Music as a whole is only limited by your creativity.


Listen to Ephel Duath, not quite latin, but youll see :)
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vincemie
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Post Mon Jun 30, 2008 1:28 pm

Steaky wrote:I don't believe it's such a clear cut question.
If you are naturally gifted either way you of course going to find the other difficult.
Both genres have tight phrasing, both deal with tempo and Time signature changes, and both require dexterity and control over the kit. But I believe any World class Jazz player who got a call from say............ NIN would have his work cut out for him to get that angular feel just right, the same as Danny Carey would have to do serious homework getting the call from Mccoy Tyner(if he's still alive). All you guy's who ask these comparison questions forget it's a question of feel, If you don't have it you won't get the gig.
p.s I heard this once a long time ago, but apparently Sepultura's Drummer is a total monster Latin player.

mccoy tyner is still alive, the last remaining john coltrane classic quartet member
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Post Mon Jun 30, 2008 1:31 pm

and he's still a smokin piano player. if anything, I think he's gotten better with age.
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Post Mon Jun 30, 2008 4:17 pm

Depends on the type of metal. Dillinger Escape Plan is crazy, extremely technical playing, in a metal atmosphere. Lamb of God is very technically difficult. However, Jazz requires a certain level of control, finesse, and nuance that metal doesn't TYPICALLY require, though some drummers choose to break the mold.
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Post Mon Jun 30, 2008 4:19 pm

Just go listen to Opeth.
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Post Mon Jun 30, 2008 4:26 pm

Howepirate wrote:Just go listen to Opeth.
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Post Mon Jun 30, 2008 4:30 pm

Timekeep69 wrote:Both are hard to play but for different reasons. Metal drumming is more physical because you have to play harder and faster. Jazz is difficult because it requires the drummer to train his body to do things it's not used to doing ( I just saw Jason Bittner show some 3 way independant stuff).

btw, Bittner is a Berkley grad and while he plays metal, he also can impressively play jazz drumming.


Why does everyone think metal has anything to do with playing "hard"?
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Post Mon Jun 30, 2008 4:37 pm

PatternsInTheIvy wrote:
Timekeep69 wrote:Both are hard to play but for different reasons. Metal drumming is more physical because you have to play harder and faster. Jazz is difficult because it requires the drummer to train his body to do things it's not used to doing ( I just saw Jason Bittner show some 3 way independant stuff).

btw, Bittner is a Berkley grad and while he plays metal, he also can impressively play jazz drumming.


Why does everyone think metal has anything to do with playing "hard"?

because it has a lot do to with playing hard. you dont always have to play hard for for the most part metal is a hard hitting style of drumming.
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Post Tue Jul 01, 2008 4:49 am

I must agree with vincemie, Jazz players dance behind highly tuned kit's with thin sizzly cymbals, whereas Metal players stomp around on low tuned powertoms with thick Z type cymbals.

Timekeep69, why do you only put it with the Jazz drummers for the 3 way Independence? Surly every drummer needs that. The better the Drummer the more rhythmic flexibility he has between his\her limbs. Rock, Metal and R&B guy's have the 'New Breed' to put themselves through their Independence breakdown(and I mean Breakdown aaargh!). Latin players can hold down and improvise with 4 seperate rhythms behind the kit at the same time.

Maybe the Question should be..........Which style is easiest to get away with not being highly skilled and practiced at?

Answer Metal. There are legions of crap Drummers in shit Metal Bands out there getting away with being shit. They cloak themselves in volume, sometimes the lucky ones get a shitty record deal and get a support tour or something and sell a few shitty hateful records to some mixed up teenagers who don't know what they like yet. But I still maintain the really great Metal bands have ridiculously amazing Drummers who can stand amongst Giants.
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