Swivel Foot Technique

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TrunJun
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Post Mon Dec 04, 2006 9:23 pm

I've begun learning the Swivel Foot technique used by drummers such as George Kollias and Derek Roddy and I was wondering if anyone had any helpful hints I could use along the way of practicing this.
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Post Mon Dec 04, 2006 11:57 pm

Hey whats up man? I cant give much advice without actually showing you, but check out some newer Dave Weckl vids. He has started using it as well as Horacio Hernandez. And JOJO Mayer. You seem like a good player, you should do yourself a favor and ditch that metal bullshit and play something with some soul, groove, and most of all FUTURE. There is nothing more sad than seeing a talented musician working a full time job so he can play with his metal band once a month when he could be making a living playing music that can actually relate to people, and not talking about death, destruction, chaos, filth, and greed,(AHX). You should check out guys like Vinnie Colaiuta, Dennis Chambers, Jeff Sipe, & of course Weckl. Its easy to see that these guys are more advanced Technically, and certainly more advanced than your average, or above average death metal drummer.
Take it easy man, I hope none of this offended you or your music, I just hope that your open to all good music, and not just the novelty of metal
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Post Tue Dec 05, 2006 12:44 am

Well, dude, you seem like a nice guy and all. If you didn't put your words the way you did, I would have flamed you and stuff like that.

Well, metal is not a novelty. Some people are just more inclined towards it than others.

And metal drummers are far from talentless. It's not easy being a metal drummer. Hell, being a drummer is not easy. There is a difference between a good metal drummer and a mediocre one.

I'm a someone who listens to (almost) every kind of music and I respect the drummers that you've mentioned. I watch their videos and listen to what advice they have. I incorporate it into my metal drumming and voila... sounds perfect. I just tweak it a little and adapt their style.

There are alot of metal drummers who are respected, popular and... well, trying not to sound too superficial, rich.

Alot of non-metal listeners think that what they play is simple, because there's no technicality to it but they can be if they want to be.

Take for example the drummer of Weezer. I don't know how technical he can get, but with the kind of songs that he plays, he can't possibly add mad fills into it. The song is supposed to be simple and easy listening. I've watched Jojo's band on youtube and the reason he can do all those things is because the band dwells on experimental stuff; almost trip-hop-ish. The same thing with metal... you can't possibly add insanely technical stuff inside, unless you're playing like experimental mathcore or some shit, but other than that, metal is all about the intensity and the speed.

That's the thing that metal listeners enjoy.

So it's not all about technicality. Ask a normal kid on the street if he knows Joey Jordison... there's a 40 to 60% possiblity he would know.

Ask the same kid if he knows Dave Weckl or Jojo Mayer... he would go... huh?

Unless of course, he's a drummer like us.

Back on topic... swivel foot. I guess all you need to know is the basics and just practice from there. Kollias's swivel foot is abit strange, from what I've seen. He swivels his heel to the right and does like 5 insanely fast beats with his ankle motion and swings it to the left and does another 5 (i'm just guessing 5... it's too fast to see).

I know alot of people who get frustrated because when they try to go faster and faster using swivel, their feet tend to go all over the place. Just practice control at a comfortable speed until the muscle memory sets in.

I guess Kollias's level of swivel is way higher than any normal person.
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Post Tue Dec 05, 2006 2:51 am

When I went to M.I. They encouraged the heel toe technique which is kind of hard to explain....basically the same concept. You can really really get some speed from these techniques. My first Instructor used a swivel/slide technique and he had the fastest single foot I have ever seen.....he now plays with Ozomatli. Try any and everything....people are different....different techniques suite different people....that goes for music too.....but you never really know unitll you try......not just try it once actually attempt to work at it. Start slow and build to the speed you desire, if you could do it slow you will be able to do it fast just work up to it. I used to think that Van Halen's "Hot for Teacher" was hard untill one of my instructors broke it down slowly....it also helped that he played with DLR. I started playing Metal....loved Death Metal...bands like Carcass and Cannibal Corpse, Metallica & Sacred Reich....I would spend hours practing to these bands in my head phones....I thought that I would NEVER play blues jazz or reggae... I ended up playing in a ska band and loving Miles Davis......Don't knock any kind of music...from Metal to hip hop to jazz to whatever, it all has its place and purpose. Keep an open mind.....Also if you wan't to stay employed as a musican in case the band doesn't work out....learn to sight read sheet music....and be as fluent in as many styles as possible....including Metal you'll find work!
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Post Tue Dec 05, 2006 6:37 am

Penis.
drumgroovy
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Post Thu Dec 07, 2006 5:14 am

Nicely put Cookness.

I dunno about any of you, but I can't be bothered to actually change my pedalling style because that means I have to start from scratch and adapt to it all over again.

I have quite fast single stroke pedalling feet, and I'm pretty satisfied with that. With the kind of music I play, I'm pretty comfortable with my speed and stamina.

I'm thinking of getting VRUK extensions though.

Well, although it may seem contradicting, I want to continue learning different techniques, although I'm already comfortable with one. Theres always space for improvement.
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Post Thu Dec 07, 2006 6:43 am

Actually learning to play other techniques makes you better at you main one, because you get to see your flaws etc. Also it makes you more aware of what's going on in your body and that's always important for a drummer.
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Post Fri Dec 08, 2006 10:02 am

CraigR wrote:Hey whats up man? I cant give much advice without actually showing you, but check out some newer Dave Weckl vids. He has started using it as well as Horacio Hernandez. And JOJO Mayer. You seem like a good player, you should do yourself a favor and ditch that metal bullshit and play something with some soul, groove, and most of all FUTURE. There is nothing more sad than seeing a talented musician working a full time job so he can play with his metal band once a month when he could be making a living playing music that can actually relate to people, and not talking about death, destruction, chaos, filth, and greed,(AHX). You should check out guys like Vinnie Colaiuta, Dennis Chambers, Jeff Sipe, & of course Weckl. Its easy to see that these guys are more advanced Technically, and certainly more advanced than your average, or above average death metal drummer.
Take it easy man, I hope none of this offended you or your music, I just hope that your open to all good music, and not just the novelty of metal


Ok, the swivel foot thing...if it improves what you do, do it. Everybody has a different style that works for them. Even people who have been taught to play using specific techniques adapt them to their own unique playing styles. NOBODY plays exactly the same...
That being said, To "CaigR"
Dude, standard advice that you can apply to every part of your life...If you don't have a clue about the suject matter you're spouting off about, don't open your mouth to begin with. I enjoy many different genres of music. You can find everything in my album collection from Morbid Angel to Fank Zappa and the Mother's of Invention. I like anything that takes thought and talent. Before you talk about metal drummers playing "bullshit", I would suggest you put down the joint, drink some coffee and sit and listen to Glass Casket, Bleeding Through, Morbid Angel and pretty much anything off of the Abacus or Metal Edge labels. The average metal drummer is playing to the point of physical pain to produce the beat that we hear. He has endurance, skill, creativity and heart. The average jam band drummer or jazz drummer plays easy, laid back, chilled rudiment driven beats that allow for screw ups as part of the whole "music on the fly" feel. You are the one who needs to be more open to other styles . From what you posted in reply to a very simple request for advice it seems that you are VERY closed minded when it comes to music.
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Post Wed Dec 13, 2006 4:11 pm

When I was in high school a lot of my drummer friends were in marching band and learned rudiments whereas I didn't. They always sounded better/tighter than me up top but I could always do things on the bass drum that they couldn't. I wonder if I'm using the swivel foot technique? My foot doesn't go side to side. I've been playing my pedal like this for a little over 21 years now so I don't think about it too much.

Many times after a show I have been asked if I use a double pedal.

I have 2 small vids showing my foot:

http://home.regent.edu/tedwards/video/Footwork1.wmv

The 2nd vid shows the fastest I can go. I'm attempting to play the drum beat from 'Hot For Teacher' on a single kick. It is a little sloppy because I'm playing too fast.

http://home.regent.edu/tedwards/video/floorcam2.wmv

I've been thinking of learning double-bass so I could play double-stroke roles with my feet.
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Post Wed Dec 13, 2006 4:22 pm

Cretin1 wrote:That being said, To "CaigR"
Dude, standard advice that you can apply to every part of your life...If you don't have a clue about the suject matter you're spouting off about, don't open your mouth to begin with. I enjoy many different genres of music. You can find everything in my album collection from Morbid Angel to Fank Zappa and the Mother's of Invention. I like anything that takes thought and talent. Before you talk about metal drummers playing "bullshit", I would suggest you put down the joint, drink some coffee and sit and listen to Glass Casket, Bleeding Through, Morbid Angel and pretty much anything off of the Abacus or Metal Edge labels. The average metal drummer is playing to the point of physical pain to produce the beat that we hear. He has endurance, skill, creativity and heart. The average jam band drummer or jazz drummer plays easy, laid back, chilled rudiment driven beats that allow for screw ups as part of the whole "music on the fly" feel. You are the one who needs to be more open to other styles . From what you posted in reply to a very simple request for advice it seems that you are VERY closed minded when it comes to music.


Well said, Cretin. My own collection runs from Meshuggah to Tower Of Power to Skynyrd to Stevie Ray Vaughn to Black Label Society. There's nothing wrong with any genre of music, you can take something for your drumming from any type of music. It's really a sin to be so closeminded as to think that someone like Chambers, Weckl or Garibaldi is more proficient at drumming than someone like Bittner, Haake, or Hoglan, when it's simply not true. It's as retarded as asking, "Who's the best drummer?". It's all subjective. There is no best. Sure, maybe Chambers can play a wicked fusion samba in 11, but can he play double kick at 190bpm for an extended period of time if the song calls for it?

Different strokes for different folks. You don't have to like the music, but show respect for the work that was put into creating it. Metal has been around since Sabbath and Zeppelin, and will be here long after all of us are gone.

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Post Wed Dec 13, 2006 5:06 pm

After doing some Google searches and watching a few different videos on 'swivel foot' I have come to the conclusion that I'm doing something else. Does anyone knows what the technique I'm doing is called?

I use a tiny bit of forward/back foot motion and control the pedal bounce to make a 'double hit' very similar to what a single hand does in a double-stroke roll.

When I was younger my foot had to travel further on the pedal to do it and I could only do it on certain pedals. After years of doing it my foot doesn't travel far at all I can do it on most drummer's pedals without thinking about it.

Any other drummers you know use this technique?
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Shalaq
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Post Thu Dec 14, 2006 1:02 am

Skytoucher- you're using the heel-toe technique. That technically is playing heel up for the downstroke and a heel down for the upstroke. Do it slowly and say if the motion is similar, only you play it at high speed.
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Post Thu Dec 14, 2006 7:11 am

Checkout Skytouchers vids.......Great Bass drum technique.
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Post Thu Dec 14, 2006 8:38 pm

heh be impressed this guys smokes kollias...trust me you will be impressed its all in french but hes the most amazing (death metal) drummer ive ever seen this is one of his lessons but if u do some good searching and find his other vids hes amazing at polyrythems and great grooves using a lot of speed metal elements in more subtle characters he gets pretty fat in some grooves i wont lie... check out this workout theres a bit of swivel in there


http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GUc2blcAoLk
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Post Fri Dec 15, 2006 10:19 am

CraigR wrote:Hey whats up man? I cant give much advice without actually showing you, but check out some newer Dave Weckl vids. He has started using it as well as Horacio Hernandez. And JOJO Mayer. You seem like a good player, you should do yourself a favor and ditch that metal bullshit and play something with some soul, groove, and most of all FUTURE. There is nothing more sad than seeing a talented musician working a full time job so he can play with his metal band once a month when he could be making a living playing music that can actually relate to people, and not talking about death, destruction, chaos, filth, and greed,(AHX). You should check out guys like Vinnie Colaiuta, Dennis Chambers, Jeff Sipe, & of course Weckl. Its easy to see that these guys are more advanced Technically, and certainly more advanced than your average, or above average death metal drummer.
Take it easy man, I hope none of this offended you or your music, I just hope that your open to all good music, and not just the novelty of metal




haha graig r what you on about. derek roddy can play jazz too he may not be good at it but he can still play. and sayin to ditch metal whats that all about?? not all metal is about death destruction etc etc check out old opeth albums the drumming on it is awsome some of the most meaningful stuff ive ever heard. come on if anything its you whose has the one track mind bullshit about jazz and fusion. plus he asked for advice and help not a slandering because he plays metal. if you cant answer the question dont type any old answer mate. i hope this didnt offend you and your lame pointless comment.

hey Trunjun check out steve smiths dvd "from drumset technique/ history of the U.S. Beat. it explains all the swivel and the heal toe technique which i have started practising! and it sounds awesome. heal toe is easy.

firstly have your whole foot on the pedal heal down. press in and the beater will hit the bass drum then lift your heal up and lift off the pedal bringin the beater back. (you toe should still be in contact witht he pedal) push down with toe and bring your heal down back to original position lifting up the toe. try to over exaggerate the process and the technique will fall into place. the sound may sound like shit when you start but it will come. skytoucher has it nailed but slow it down dude as well :D. but great work.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hoPv1oM6vZM

check out tim waterson he has some great videos free and they explain stuff.

good luck matey.
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