Double Bass Technique

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Jesus
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Post Sun Sep 09, 2007 2:45 pm

I have been playing a mix of heel down and heel up for about a year and a half now, and it's not getting me much more speed than it should. Would some people be so kind as to share their techniques and tips?
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Post Thu Sep 20, 2007 9:41 am

when i use double my double pedal
i try to concentrate on doing heel down
it makes for better technique and you can control the pedal a lot more
it really doesnt matter tho

but i usually just use heel toe on a single pedal because i dont need to use double bassing in my drumming

but if you want a real nice double bass technique
use heel/toe

derrick pope explains it very well
just as he explains everything else
its actually very easy

http://drummerworld.com/Drumclinic/Derrick_Pope3.html
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Jesus
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Post Fri Sep 21, 2007 9:16 pm

natestaur wrote:when i use double my double pedal
i try to concentrate on doing heel down
it makes for better technique and you can control the pedal a lot more
it really doesnt matter tho

but i usually just use heel toe on a single pedal because i dont need to use double bassing in my drumming

but if you want a real nice double bass technique
use heel/toe

derrick pope explains it very well
just as he explains everything else
its actually very easy

http://drummerworld.com/Drumclinic/Derrick_Pope3.html


Holy Hell that guy knows his stuff. Never seen him before, but thank you for posting the link.
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mattcore
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Post Sun Sep 30, 2007 5:36 pm

try the swivel technique. Search for it in youtube and you'll find a how to vid. George Kollias uses it and he's damn quick!
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Post Mon Oct 08, 2007 7:34 pm

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Post Tue Oct 30, 2007 8:13 pm

You will play faster heel up, the mechanics are such that its just impossible to play as fast heel down without more effort than should be needed. there are a lot of techniques for heel up, I like the swivel technique for playing fast double-strokes but at slower tempos I usually don't use it. the thing to realize is that your natural tendency is to put the heel down because its more comfortable since the muscles for playing heel-up will at first be not as developed, don't let this trick into playing heel down though, over time you will get the strength and the speed and control will come and you will be playing faster heel-up than you ever could heel-down. There are times when heel-down is appropriate but for speed and power you are only limiting yourself with it.
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Post Wed Oct 31, 2007 10:38 am

start slow keeping it even then work up the tempo until you loose it or can play any faster keep doing this and you will get faster.

And for the technique its whatever feels best for you.
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Post Thu Nov 01, 2007 6:57 am

I was having the same problem, and I switched to a variation of flat-foot: I keep my feet at roughly a 90 degree angle to the floor, and I strike the pedal with the ball of my foot towards the back of the footboard, using my hip flexors to drive my whole leg. My power, consistency, and speed are better than ever.
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Jesus
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Post Thu Nov 01, 2007 9:37 pm

GrindheadJim wrote:I was having the same problem, and I switched to a variation of flat-foot: I keep my feet at roughly a 90 degree angle to the floor, and I strike the pedal with the ball of my foot towards the back of the footboard, using my hip flexors to drive my whole leg. My power, consistency, and speed are better than ever.

Derek Roddy uses that...Although I can't understand it. So you use the ball of your foot to press down? Or are you soley depending on your thighs and what nots to deliver the punch?
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Post Fri Nov 02, 2007 6:22 am

Jesus wrote:
GrindheadJim wrote:I was having the same problem, and I switched to a variation of flat-foot: I keep my feet at roughly a 90 degree angle to the floor, and I strike the pedal with the ball of my foot towards the back of the footboard, using my hip flexors to drive my whole leg. My power, consistency, and speed are better than ever.

Derek Roddy uses that...Although I can't understand it. So you use the ball of your foot to press down? Or are you soley depending on your thighs and what nots to deliver the punch?


It's a combination; almost like a whipping motion sometimes. Mostly, though, the punch does come from my hips/thighs.
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Jesus
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Post Thu Nov 08, 2007 6:21 pm

GrindheadJim wrote:
Jesus wrote:
GrindheadJim wrote:I was having the same problem, and I switched to a variation of flat-foot: I keep my feet at roughly a 90 degree angle to the floor, and I strike the pedal with the ball of my foot towards the back of the footboard, using my hip flexors to drive my whole leg. My power, consistency, and speed are better than ever.

Derek Roddy uses that...Although I can't understand it. So you use the ball of your foot to press down? Or are you soley depending on your thighs and what nots to deliver the punch?


It's a combination; almost like a whipping motion sometimes. Mostly, though, the punch does come from my hips/thighs.


Whipping motion...could you describe that in different words please.
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Post Fri Nov 09, 2007 7:26 am

Jesus wrote:Whipping motion...could you describe that in different words please.


The motion starts in my hips, and, almost in a wave, runs down my leg all the way to my heel. Then, my foot kind of "whips" forward and down into the pedal. The key is that the power originates at the top of my leg, and that force is amplified by each muscle in my leg on the way down; and I DO NOT TENSE. Relaxation is key.
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Post Sat Jan 26, 2008 1:47 pm

you should become proficient in heel up and heel down as well as with leg and without leg. at any time you may need any of these techniques to get the sound you want, the speed you need, or the accuracy thats required.

heel down is good for medium to somewhat fast playing with a high degree of accuracy. its easiest to play syncopated rhythms, shuffles, or mid tempo grooves in this position. it can however limit speed and maximum volume somewhat.

heel up is good for slow and very very fast playing depending on whether you are using a lot of leg or not.
use your whole leg for controlling your speed when you want to maintain a slower tempo and keep your beats even and not speed up. also use your whole leg if you need to get a huge sound. this can limit your speed significantly though, and its hard to play quietly moving an entire leg with each stroke.

if you want pure blasting speed however, moving the whole leg isnt going to cut it. also keeping your heel down isnt going to cut it either. playing heel up but keeping you leg hovered above the pedal allows maximum ankle flexibility and rebound, and thus maximum speed. your ankle should just pivot up and down while you leg hangs out with your heel an inch or so off the pedal board. ideally your ankle should not be fully extended when the beater hits the head but also not fully flexed when the beater is in its highest up position. this will keep your foot in its most powerful position at all times...somewhere in the middle of its range. with this technique your accuracy suffers some. its hard to play syncopated rhythms or start and stop on a dime because you are floating in the air.


depending on the complexity of the beat you want to play you might be switching between moving your leg and keeping it still, and putting you heels up or down. i dont think about it that much, i just use the technique that gets the right sound. if one isnt working i automatically switch to another.

if you get stuck in one technique you are limiting the type of playing you can do, or at least making life really hard for yourself.

Finally: AT ALL TIMES let the beater rebound off the head. burying the beater, or not letting it come off the head after a stroke is the easiest way to limit yourself in terms of speed. if you want to play fast you have to let the springs on the pedal and the tension of the head help you out.

note: all of this applies to single strokes only. i cant play double strokes anyway...
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Jesus
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Post Mon Jan 28, 2008 10:00 am

Bloomdrums wrote:you should become proficient in heel up and heel down as well as with leg and without leg. at any time you may need any of these techniques to get the sound you want, the speed you need, or the accuracy thats required.

heel down is good for medium to somewhat fast playing with a high degree of accuracy. its easiest to play syncopated rhythms, shuffles, or mid tempo grooves in this position. it can however limit speed and maximum volume somewhat.

heel up is good for slow and very very fast playing depending on whether you are using a lot of leg or not.
use your whole leg for controlling your speed when you want to maintain a slower tempo and keep your beats even and not speed up. also use your whole leg if you need to get a huge sound. this can limit your speed significantly though, and its hard to play quietly moving an entire leg with each stroke.

if you want pure blasting speed however, moving the whole leg isnt going to cut it. also keeping your heel down isnt going to cut it either. playing heel up but keeping you leg hovered above the pedal allows maximum ankle flexibility and rebound, and thus maximum speed. your ankle should just pivot up and down while you leg hangs out with your heel an inch or so off the pedal board. ideally your ankle should not be fully extended when the beater hits the head but also not fully flexed when the beater is in its highest up position. this will keep your foot in its most powerful position at all times...somewhere in the middle of its range. with this technique your accuracy suffers some. its hard to play syncopated rhythms or start and stop on a dime because you are floating in the air.


depending on the complexity of the beat you want to play you might be switching between moving your leg and keeping it still, and putting you heels up or down. i dont think about it that much, i just use the technique that gets the right sound. if one isnt working i automatically switch to another.

if you get stuck in one technique you are limiting the type of playing you can do, or at least making life really hard for yourself.

Finally: AT ALL TIMES let the beater rebound off the head. burying the beater, or not letting it come off the head after a stroke is the easiest way to limit yourself in terms of speed. if you want to play fast you have to let the springs on the pedal and the tension of the head help you out.

note: all of this applies to single strokes only. i cant play double strokes anyway...


This is a good explanation and reasoning. I think what might help is taking the time to learn the swivel technique. Speed, accuracy, power, and the ability to do double strokes and more.
ilold
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Bloomdrums
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Post Mon Jan 28, 2008 11:09 am

im not sure what the swivel technique is exactly... ive tried heel/toe technique and my feet are to big. someone once told me it doesnt atter how big your feet are you can still play hell/toe, but his feet were only like size 9 so how would he know?
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